FICTION AND DOCUMENTARY
interview with editor Dortih Vinken
Auteur: Lotte van Geijn
13.03.2015
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| Filmstill 'Brozer' 2014 |
In the afternoon I sit down with
Dorith Vinken. She is a Dutch editor with an impressive list of films,
documentaries and series to her name. Twice she was nominated for a ‘Gouden
Kalf’ for editing. The last few years she worked on a huge project that
resulted in the incredible movie ‘Brozer’. The film started as fiction and
ended as a documentary. It is about one of the actresses; Leonoor Pauw dying of
cancer. ‘Brozer’ is a sequel to the movie ‘Broos’ (1997) about five sisters
struggling with family relationships. It was clear when they started to shoot
‘Bozer’ Leonoor Pauw was terminally ill.
This was also included in the fiction script. At a certain point the movie
would end and Leonoor would be able to spent the last period of her life with
her family, but she decided that she wanted to continue filming. At this point
the fiction became reality. The actresses started to use their own names. But
how do you edit this transition from fiction to documentary in such a way it is
clear to the viewer?
Lotte van Geijn:
Why did you choose to become a film editor?
Dorith Vinken:
My first choice was camera when I studied at the Film
Academy in Amsterdam. But when I was asked to edit a
graduation movie I found it incredible to do.
The most exceptional thing of editing is that you write the movie again.
The scenario has been written, the film shots are made, but in the editing room
it is possible to explore the idea again. There are always things that have to
change in order to create a good film.
How do we find solutions for certain problems? This puzzling is what I
really like about the process of editing, as well as the co-working with the
director I really prefer in this job.
Also it is away from the hectic set. I don’t like the process on the set
with all the people running around all the time. My heart beats faster to see
the final product of the film. The moment I chose editing instead of camera at
the academy it felt like a big relieve. Then I knew I made the right decision.
Lotte van Geijn:
What is the relationship between you and the director?
The most final decisions are made in the editing room.
Dorith Vinken:
You have to be able as an editor to take a modest position. Because it
is the director who must lay his or her egg. You have to work together, but in
the beginning I was so convinced that I knew the right way to do it and I put
all my energy in the fight with the director. Now I know with all my
experiences that if I keep giving good arguments about how I receive it,
because I am the first viewer, the director is maybe at first not convinced,
but after more people have watched the material during the process of making
and also agree with my arguments, the director changes his opinion and I often
get my equal without fighting.
I often work with directors who have the same taste as I do and then I
don’t have to make concessions.
Lotte van Geijn:
You have been working on different kind of movies and
series, both fiction and documentary. Can you explain the differences within
the working process? The choices that you make?
Dorith Vinken:
The big difference between fiction and documentary is within fiction you
work with a scenario, the story is fixed. With a documentary there is also a
story but it is more like a schedule. There are assumptions how things will
work out, they have done research, but there can happen something halfway that
makes you decide to chance the whole story. With fiction I often start working
alone, I follow the script, later the director joins. With a documentary this
is not possible and I start together with the director.
Lotte van Geijn:
Do you prefer fiction or documentary?
Dorith Vinken:
No I don’t. I really like the variation. What I learn from documentary I
can use with fiction and the other way around. It has to do with the technique.
How you edit. With fiction there is a plan how to record the scenes;
mise-en-scene, if it starts with a close-up or a total shot. In documentary it
is more following. It influences the way I edit, and I can use the different
techniques for different films.
Lotte van Geijn:
In the movie 'Brozer' of Mijke de Jong fiction and
reality intersect. How did you experience this process?
Dorith Vinken:
This was the biggest problem of the film. It was for us the major
challenge. The film was intended as fiction. Of course we did know that one of
the main actresses Leonoor Pauw was
going to die. We didn’t know the end of the movie yet. We did know that Leonoor
looked at the project as a beautiful challenge, but she was going to spent the
last period of her life with her family and not on the set. Over the course of
three years we did recordings and editing. Leonoor often came over to watch the
editing process. She had a wish to go the Norway to see the northern lights
and that would be the end of the movie. So they went, I edited it afterwards
and then Leonoor said; ‘We have to continue. We cannot stop here. We have to
continue until the end.’ It was her decision to continue filming, but also of
her husband and children. And at that point everybody had to become their
selves and the actresses had to change there fictional names intro there own
names. For some of the actresses this
was a very difficult process. At a certain point one of them asks herself; 'What
am I doing here? I’m just a colleague of you, don’t you prefer a good friend
next to your bed now?' There was a shift
from profession to private. It became a huge responsibility for all of use. The
switch from fiction to documentary was difficult. We asked the actresses to
film themselves with their I-phones and they explained their troubles with the
process. ‘Is it fiction? Is it documentary? What is my position? But what am I
worrying about compare to Leonoor; she is dying.’ It shows their dilemmas and
their difficulties, it makes it very sincere. It is very sincere. And this
material made it possible for me in the editing to make the transition from
fiction to documentary clear to the viewer.
Lotte van Geijn:
Is it the role of a filmmaker/editor to stay as close
as possible to the reality within documentary making? Or showing a fictional
personal view on the world around us?
Dorith Vinken:
The most important thing is to tell the story in the best way possible.
In this case the reality was of course extremely tough and merciless. But the
choices are; what do you show? This was an interesting process. The husband of
Leonoor had a big influence. He told us not to be to gently, show how sick
someone is, how much pain she can have. The responsibility of me and the
director (Mijke de Jong) was to know where to draw the line. To keep it
tasteful and intangible. There was a lot of material that was crossing the
line, that we couldn’t use. We are very proud how we found a solution to show
the moment that she passed away. It is not a shock but a gentle transition.
Lotte van Geijn:
Is a movie a reflection of our world? Or are we so
used to watching movies that it is the other way around? That we expect our
life to be as in the movie?
Dorith Vinken:
When you talk about film and reality the strange thing is that the
reality is very difficult to catch in a movie, because it is often more
incomprehensible, more shocking, more insane, then what you can show in a film.
It does happen sometimes in documentaries, that there are situations that are
real, but when you put them in a movie; you just don’t believe it.
Film have had a big influence on us. It is the strongest art form, of
course a painting, music or dance can touch the heart, but a movie can be a
real experience. It is beautiful way of telling stories. It is a modern way of
storytelling.
Lotte van Geijn:
What is your opinion about the influence of movies at
our society? And does this bring responsibilities? Or is the filmmaker free in
his/her process?
Dorith Vinken:
I think the influence is incomprehensible, it is bigger than most of us
think it is. I think moviemakers should not be too aware of this fact, because
then they adjust to much, but of course they also have a responsibility. But
there are also very headstrong directors like Lars von Trier. It is important
that there are innovative moviemakers as well.
Lotte van Geijn:
On what subject would you like to edit a film of in
the future?
Dorith Vinken:
There are so many subjects! It happens often that I see a movie and
wished I had made it myself. The last time I felt like this was with the film
‘Mommy’. It is about an autistic boy and his mother. It is fiction. I love the
way they act, with an intensity and no bullshit. A very beautiful movie. I
prefer to make that kind of movies, instead of being so aesthetic in image. To
tell a story that really touches people
in the heart. When I make a movie I need to be touched myself and I don’t stop
editing until this happens.
-Lotte van Geijn
